I think most people on niche platforms like this are westerners (edit: by “westerner” I mean someone who is a “native” of countries with a western culture), and I’m bored so I just want to talk and share a different perspective. (Also, because Lemmy is a bit quiet at the moment, too quiet for my liking)
Political questions are welcomed.
What is something from Chinese culture that you wish was more popular in the west?
For me it’s intergenerational family homes. I think its an efficient way to raise a family.
Maybe the idea that teachers and students should repect each other more. I’m just shocked to see that in the US, kids are just to cruel to teacher, and teachers are also just so unfair to students. Like, it’s a place to learn, can we not have this war between generations? School is just so frustrating.
But I’ve only been in at most 2nd grade in China, idk if Chinese classrooms also have such drama as it does in the US.
I think a little bit of collectivism is also good. Obviously I don’t want society to become a hivemind, but just some common sense. Like masking shouldn’t be that political. In China, HK, and Taiwan, people just wear a mask. Idk why so many Americans just refuse because of “freedom” or some BS. You wanna know what an actual infringement of freedom is? Getting your door welded shut by the authorities, and sometimes forcibly taken to “quarrantine center” (there are actually quarrantine centers, but it’s sometimes used as a convienient tool against dissidents). A mask is nothing compared to that. In the US, there isn’t even any authorities enforcing quarrantines, it just a “hey can you please behave yourselves” public announcement. In fact, I think that even if China used the US strategy of dealing with Covid, China will still do better than the US. China has this collectist social pressure that’ll make people conform and wear a mask.
(But conversely, some could argue that the same collectivism is why China is unwilling to dissent against injustice, it’s sorta a double-edge sword, we have to find the right balance)
Collectivism can be good, but beware of the toxic fake collectivism practiced in China, where “sacrifice yourself for the greater good” is just code for “sacrifice yourself for the rich”.
Intergenerational family homes are a result of poverty. They are not something to aspire to. It’s because those people are generally too poor to buy homes.
And we’re going back to that in the west now. I’m a skilled tradesman with over a decade of experience and I get paid so poorly I had to move back in with my mom.
They are not a result of poverty. Its common around the world to take care of your parents when they are old. Only in the west do we think its normal to chuck our parents in a retirement home when they are old.
Taking care of your parents and having to live with them as working adult because you’re paid so poorly are worlds apart.
Yeah and I’m clearly not talking about being forced to live with them so I don’t know why you keep bring that up.
But that’s the entire reason that most places in the world have intergenerational homes.
It’s like saying, “I think we should go back to women being homemakers. No no, I’m clearly not talking about the 99% of homemakers that didn’t have a choice about it.”
I don’t agree and your example is not relevant. Women having the freedom to choose to work or stay home is completely different than taking care of your parents when they are elderly.
Its more expensive to take care of your parents in an intergenerational home than it is to ignore your parents and let the government take care of them.
Well first you said intergenerational homes, now you’re saying taking care of parents when they’re old.
You’re just changing your statement in an attempt to dismiss my response.
deleted by creator
Normalizing intergenerational family homes would make abusive parents impossible to escape from, and goodness knows there are a lot of abusive parents in both countries.
No it wouldn’t because you do not need to invite your parents to live with you. I’m living by myself in my 20s and early 30s and my parents are living by themselves until they’re around 70+.
I would only ask them to live with me once I was in a position to support them or they were unable to support themselves. If my parents were abusive I’d simply not ask them to live with me.
You have the opportunity to do that because intergenerational family homes are not normalized. If they were, you would not be paid enough to afford a home of your own. You would be financially forced to live with your parents.
How do you figure that my pay would decrease just because I care for my elderly parents?
Because employers pay employees as little as possible. If you don’t have to pay rent, your employer doesn’t have to pay you enough to afford rent.
I don’t think you understand. An intergenerational home is not you living with your parents. It’s your parents living with you and your family.
What’s the difference?
When you go to a Chinese restaurant, do you order in English or Chinese?
Chinese (Cantonese if it’s run by people who speak Cantonese), because I don’t want them to think I’m a “American-Born Chinese”. I feel like I have a higher “social-status” amongst the Chinese diaspora if I speak Chinese, as in, I fear they’d think lower of me if I spoke English only (sounds silly, I know). But it depends. Sometime “Chinese Restaurants” aren’t even staffed by people who speak Chinese, so that’ll have to be in English.
Damn is that a common problem? (like Americans might be elitist about having an accent or not having an iPhone I imagine)
When I hear my parents talking with someone, they’d be like “Is your son a ABC (American-Born Chinese) or born in China? Does he speak Chinese?” Then when my mom replies “He left when he was little. He can understand and speak both Cantonese and Mandarin and even read some written text” then the person is like “That’s amazing he can understand so much! I thought he only spoke English!”. This happens all the time.
So basically I get the impression that if I only knew English, they think lower of me. Maybe I’m just overthinking it.
Do you not consider yourself to be a westerner?
I think the term “westerner” is more referring to someone who was born in a country with western culture. I do consider my self an American, but the term “westerner” feels like a term that tells more about where a person was born in. Or maybe I’m just misunderstanding the terminology.
I always thought of it as where someone is from. Not necessarily where they were born. I’m as [my state] as you can get but I only moved here around the age you moved to America. My grandpa was the most American man I ever met despite being in middle school when he got off the boat.
If you immigrate as an adult or teenager maybe not, but even then maybe yes. Who am I to tell some chick that moved here from Iran as a 20 year old that she’s any less one of us. In general if you consider yourself fully an American I think of you as a westerner regardless of how you wound up an American.
Well I mean, the term “American” is describing nationality. So anyone with US citizenship is, by definition, an American.
But I’m not sure what the term “westerner” even mean. Like, if it was a term that was used in the way like how “European” or “Asian” is used, then you can’t really become a westerner could you? Like I could move to Europe, but I can’t become a European.
But it depends on how the word “westerner” is defined. I’m not an English professor, so I have no idea how the word is supposed to be used.
“The West” is a very nebulous and hard-to-define concept at best, and so the term “Westerner” can be equally hard to pin down to one single definition.
In my experience, though, it generally refers to cultural background rather than ethnicity. If a person grows up in a “Western” country to the extent that their mindset and outlook is aligned with that country’s cultural values and way of life, then they are a Westerner, regardless of their ancestry.
How do you feel about the propaganda put out by China vrs the propaganda put out by the USA
The official narrative of any country is obviously going to be biased. The difference with propaganda by the Communist Party of China, is that there is no alternative platforms in China. So in China, you either believe in the official narrative, or just invent your own narrarive based on limited information that gets spread amongst people and based on speculation. Obviously, I don’t trust the CCP narrative.
In the US, I wouldn’t trust what the person in the white house says either, but at least there is at least freedom of press and I can compare what each news outlet says and paint a better picture of what’s happening.
I’m not sure if I’m answering your question.
I saw a very good summarization of this by a Russian YouTuber. According to him, “While the west does have different sources of propaganda, Russia (and I would add China here) has monopolized state propaganda.”
Nah that was a solid enough answer, thanks
What do you miss most about life in China?
Not much that I can remember. I was like elementary school age when I left, I haven’t had much experiences.
Don’t know what part of China you were from but damn for me it’s the food. Sichuan food is about the best thing I ever put in my mouth. So many flavours.
I had the opposite experience as you as I moved to China from NZ in my early 20’s, and I loved the life and liveliness there, and as a clearly non Chinese person, the people were super friendly (some well beyond the point of invading my privacy) but it was still an overall great experience.
traditional chinese or simplified chinese which one is better?
Simplified because I’m lazy and I can’t imagine trying to learn traditional.
But traditional does looks more sophisticated, but I just am not willing to learn something so complex. Even simplified is difficult enough. Good thing I moved to a country with a simpler language… I guess… 😅
(Well english isn’t simple, but at least I only need to know how to write 26 characters)
Real talk - how often do you experience overt, interpersonal racism? How often do you experience more subtle “accidental” racism?
What part of the country are you in?
I live in the east coast US in a non-red state and blue city, that’s as specific as I want to get. Racism is quite common especially in elementary school, but it gets more rare in higher levels of education.
Subtle racism is extrememly common, even in highschool. Most common ones are “why are your eyes that way”, “do you like cats and dogs” (implying them being food), etc.
I went to college for a bit (before I couldn’t handle it anymore due to depression). I’ve never experienced racism in college nor the off-campus apartments that’s owned by the university. Maybe racism is just symptoms of immaturity and ignorance.
Genuinely, thank you for detailed comments like this. My partner is Chinese. She won’t talk about stuff like this but I know she’s experienced some of it, and seeing comments like yours helps me to understand it more.
Thanks for sharing your experience! Those examples don’t seem so subtle at all! Sorry you have to live with that shit
Oh, there’ve been more direct racism. The infamous slur against Chinese people:
"Ch*nk", "Ch*ng-chong", the "Chinese Middle-finger", "Go back to where you came from", etc...Sometimes the racism is from white kids, sometimes it’s from non-white kids, I’ve even once had another immigrant from Southeast Asia being racist to me. Like wtf. It’s kinda surprising that a person of one minority group would discriminate against a person of a different minority group. Like… if this is how divided people are, we will never have unity amongst oppressed groups like us. We should be uniting against racism, not become racists ourselves. But again, this is elementary school and middle school, maybe this is just immaturity. Highschool have way less racists, and the kids who are racists are less overt.
Is there something from the Mainland that you always thought the Chinese did better, but found out the Americans did better? Anything vice versa?
Bro you’re a westerner by any measure. Unless you have spent your formative years in China you are considered a westerner even if you have Chinese blood
Oh, so I guess I just misunderstood the term. Because I always thought “westerner” was like “European” or “North American”, something that is attributed to race. I guess I’ve been using the word wrong this whole time.
I sometimes still don’t know what some words actually mean.
There’s tons of people who are all sorts of ethnicities that are still westerners.
I mean… If you spent last decade shit posting on reddit in English, certified westerner lol
Western can mean different things. The most modern way to view it is someone who uses enlightenment values, or for a country one that is democratic.
Originally the western world meant Greece, as they were west from the Persians. Ancient Greek philosophy was picked up again during the Renaissance, led to the scientific revolution and the enlightenment.
Do you get a lot of scam calls in Chinese? I’ve heard there’s some nasty stuff they try to dupe people with.
Scam calls? Lol I just block all calls except contacts (unless I’m expecting an important call or something).
But my parents get a lot of scam calls. Mostly in English, but occasionally they get those fake Chinese Embassey calls.
Do you feel like people who were born in America take it for granted?
People born in the US don’t understand that in some countries people live a completely different life, Education isn’t free (well it technically is paid for by taxes in the US, but you get my point), and you can’t just move to wherever you want, even if its within your own country. There is no social benefits (at least when I left).
In China, I was born in a city, but my Hukou (Household Registration) was in a rural village where my father was from. So I couldn’t get free public education in the city, and my parents have to pay for a private school (which according to my parents, is worse than public education, unlike the US where private schools are better). Hukou system means that if you moved to somewhere outside of where your Hukou is, you are basically an immigrant in your own country. Imagine if, in the US, if you moved to a place other than what was listed on your birth certificate, you lose any welfare you get, you can’t go to public school, buying property becomes a hassle, etc. That sounds ridiculous, isn’t it?
Uk… Stuff like this is what makes me livid when I come across tankies (Lemmy is unfortunately littered by them). Anyways, glad that your family made out to a better place! Cheers :)
Do you like Panda Express?
No. Honestly I only ever ate in local (non franchised) Chinese restaurants. I haven’t even heard of Panda Express until around Covid. Then I heard about their delivery bussiness booming when local restaurants shut down. That’s when I googled it and I got the impression that it’s just some fast food franchise that sells extremely Americanized Chinese food that isn’t really high quality. Somehow I just don’t feel like their food is as good as the actual Chinese restaurants that I go to. I never tried it, and I don’t think I want to.
They used to be fine in the 90s, but the last ten or do years, their quality has gone to crap. It just makes me sick these days.
I agree with this in general. However, I’ve had some pretty terrible food from small Chinese restaurants. I used to know a good one but they closed during COVID. Do you have any tips for finding good ones? Maybe certain menu items to look for that shows they know their shit?
Find a neighborhood with high concentration of ethnic Chinese people and find a Chinese restaurant there. I’ve always had good Chinese restaurants nearby because I never live too far from other ethnic Chinese people.
Do you feel any connection with China (the country)?
Honestly, I barely speak enough Chinese to form any sort of connection. I really dislike my Grandparent’s conservstism (they live in the US btw), I feel like when older Chinese people talk, I don’t really have anything in common with them.
The “connection” that I feel is just the hope for China to become a democratic country that has good diplomatic relations with the US, so the anti-Chinese sentinment in the US can stop. Besides that, I guess I really like Cantonese Cuisine so I’m sorta attached to the Culinary aspect of China.
But like what does having a “connection” with a country even mean in the context of your question? I’m not sure if I’m understanding the question correctly.
I’m trying to separate the country China from the culture Chinese.
Like do you mean as in: Do I feel any obligation if there’s a war or something? No. Under Chinese law, citizenship is automatically revoked if you obtain foreign citizenship. So both legally and morally, I have no obligation.
It was more if you feel any personal connection, not if you have a legal obligation. You basically answered it but you asked for clarification.
What year did you move to the US and what visa were you under when you first arrived? Also, how long did it take to get your green card, then from GC to naturalization?
I moved to the US in 2010, it was a family based immigration visa, sponsored by a sibling of my father. And my mother and older brother and I can come as addition family members.
My parents told me that the petition started before I was born, it took more than 13 years of waiting.
When you enter at customs, they give you a temporary green card (basically a sticker on your passport), then you get the actual one in the mail.
My mother applied for citizenship as soon as the 5 year mark (well technically you could file a few months before, but they don’t start processing until the 5 year mark). From the 5 year mark until getting the naturalization certificatw took only 1-2 months I think. But I personally didn’t have to apply because I was still a minor so I automatically gain citizenship derived from my mother’s naturalization.
how did you choose your username?
I lost access to my original Lemmy user account because I forgot my password to my Bitwarden Vault that has the Lemmy password, so I kinda just contemplated life, existence, the chain of events that led up to this shitty moment. WtfEvenIsExistence is what was in my mind, it’s basically my outlook on life.
My original user account is @[email protected]
And that’s because its from Futurama
spoiler
The first 2 lines of the time code in Bender’s Big Score
This reminds me, I should put the password to my password keeper vault somewhere. If I lost that, I would be so screwed.
