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- cross-posted to:
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Use Firefox.
Support Firefox.
Using alternative Chromium based browsers is not it.
Firefox is wonderful 💯
I absolutely would if I could get it to run decently on my Mac… it just slows to a crawl, especially page scrolling. I’m stuck on Edge for now, but having a look at Orion as an alternative
I’ve been using firefox almost exclusively on my macs for years. It never gives me any issues.
It works for me with zero issues on my MBP.
Aye so people keep telling me, I wish I knew what was causing my issues as would much rather be using it - prefer the UI, the customisation etc but the performance I just had to give up on the end.
I see the Reddit BS of downvoting stuff people disagree with has moved to Lemmy as well… Won’t take long for the morons to ruin open conversations on here as well 🙄🤦🏻♂️
you might try waterfox. It’s a stripped down firefox. Might work for you better?
Even if they do that, some people will just create illegal website mirrors that remove ads.
On reddit, people already copy paste articles when there’s a paywall. I can totally envision that thing to be more common.
I am not fucking kidding, I will stop using websites if I cannot block ads. This is non negotiable. I don’t care about your business model, I have zero money to give you. I tried the official reddit app, and uninstalled within a week.
I’ve even seen websites that copy stackoverflow questions and answers word for word, and just displays them differently.
I think that’s spammy SEO abuse though… Not circumventing ads or anything.
Well if the OG source uses DRM, fuck em! I don’t care if Google’s search engine goes to shit. Not sure how much shittier it can get, but fuck em!
I said this the other day and had a user suggest there’s no point because Google will win, and it’ll be impossible to avoid this DRM garbage. They didn’t seem to grasp that you can just not use the websites that use that tech.
I won’t use them then, and go offline I guess
Same here. Actually I uninstalled the official Reddit app within a day after seeing all these ads. My web experience is almost completely ad-free and if some ad or site comes around with ads ir user tracking, I don’t use it.
I haven’t watched any un-proxied YouTube video for over five years now. Not sure how long this will still be possible in the future but I hope that also in the future people will find ways to circumvene big-tech surveillance.
It was not hilarious when MS tried to control stuff like this with IE.
This is a boring fight, and it is why tech companies need a broken up and a kick in the profits/pants.
I can’t imagine anyone who uses the internet thinking the current ad technology is effective, the web is broken because of ads
Bc of ads? Ads are mostly fine, the web is broken because of platforms. Like there’s only a handful of sites the entire planet uses and they’re all owned by like 4 tech giants (and Reddit)
Assuming all ads are legit and don’t contain some sketchy script to activate your webcam or scan your cookies (hint: haha, living in lala land if you trust all ads!), have you ever checked what percentage of your bandwidth gets wasted on advertising?
I’m not saying ads are perfect, but they’re not the thing that’s strangling and ruining the internet. They’ve always been a part of it.
But also like any website can run arbitrary code like that. Most ad platforms don’t allow their customers to just have arbitrary js.
And no, arbitrary internet code didn’t exist before Java came out in 1996.
When that came out, I already sensed it was the beginning of the end…
Okay, buddy
They have not always been a part of the net, I can guarantee you that. Used to have my own totally free site back around 1999/2000 or so. No ads whatsoever, written entirely from Notepad.
Please don’t try telling me the history of the net before you were born.
So first, you don’t know my age. Don’t be weird.
Second, just because you ran a personal site without ads doesn’t mean ads weren’t part of the internet…
It’s broken because of platforms working for people, which happens because there’s not too much, but too little fragmentation.
For a couple decades corps and their fans were communicating from every orifice that fragmentation is bad, it’s bad for developers, it’s bad for users, it’s bad for business and so on.
Despite this being not only wrong, but also counterintuitive, as we should all be familiar with how things work in nature, about evolution and competition and diversity.
It isn’t Google Engineers wanting to do it. It’s Google engineers being told to do it.
this is what i’m frustrated with. why do all these engineers let themselves be told what to do even if it makes a worse-functioning tool? that’s not real engineering.
“because they’ll get fired”
not if enough of them do the thing that should’ve been what got them interested in engineering in the first place.
maybe we shouldn’t call them engineers, but something else relating to being the one who does the dirty work for institutions that aim to steal people’s attention and decrease their quality of life.
and if they do get fired, then they should join together and make the reasonable company that makes good tools for human use.
A point made by Morten Rand-Hendriksen: We software engineers are not real engineers. Unlike other kind of engineers, we do not have to follow industry code of conudct like meachincal engineers or civil engineers. We are just a bunch dudes that learned to use tensorflow on stackoverflow. That is why our work is dangerous and we can always just “be told” what to do for money.
Airplanes could not be built like that. Calling ourselfs “engineers” is misleading as it suggest we follow some ethics or code of conduct. It will hurt us on the long run.
very interesting point
That’s called doing your job though. Do you just regularly… tell your boss to fuck off with their requirements?
In an environment where software engineers are being laid off by the thousands, I don’t think anyone’s going to hand in a resignation letter just because the prestigious ad company they’re working for is… making them force ads on people.
Many of them will also have to go back to India if they quit their jobs. What’s that, a 10x difference in income?
Also, it’s probably only a handful of people who are implementing this ‘enhancement.’ It’s not like a small team has any real bargaining power.
Google engineers want me to stop using anything from google
Already switched to proton mail, MEGA, startpage search , firefox. Hoping more people to donate to pine64 Linux phones so that they become mainstream.
And when it comes to phones, there are now quite a few alternatives to Stock Android. /eOS uses MicroG instead of google services to allow for almost all apps to run fine while being more private and open source. You can also just use LineageOS and use MicroG as an alternative!
MicroG depends on Google. Yea…fuck that
Better for most people who still need to use most apps
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Use Firefox.
Even the Android version lets you install uBlock Origin.
Can’t on iOS though 😓
That’s Apples fault. They force every mobile browser to be a reskinned version of Safari.
Why in the fucking world would you use Apple?
Bc every other smartwatch is miles behind apple tbh
Da fuck are you talking about?
And another question: did someone already lay out a roadmap to google’s collapse?
Right now we’re going through a financial crisis, big tech needs to start making proper money so they try to squeeze the users. Google hopes to “drm the internet” to maximise ad revenue. Let’s assume they succeed. 3 years from now the dystopia of dead adblockers is live, google and other leeches make bank off ads.
But there’s no more adblockers and no more ad revenue left to squeeze out (because every internet user is already chained to a screen and force fed ads within ads). And shareholders demand increase in profits. What do they do then? Is there any hint of a long-term strategy? How long before the maximum theoretical ad revenue is reached and plateaus? Then COVID29 or something comes, fed raises rastes again and…?
You’re describing the inherent limitations of capitalism. Our entire economy is predicated on infinite growth, which doesn’t exist and isn’t possible. What you describe is the eventual collapse of not just organizations, but of the US as a whole.
No, not the US as a whole, but perhaps the end of the insane and without reasonable measures Capitalism that it has spawned. This is the theorized late-stage capitalism, but it was brought to this level by a broken and out of control system, whereas the academic model of capitalism would have had certain mechanisms of balance to prevent exactly where we are.
The system of the present is too imbalanced to function with all these corporations, conglomerates, and billionaires holding a disproportionate amount of the wealth and keeping it from circulating. The economic system in the US just can’t work this way, so some drastic shift to reduce or remove the wealth gap will need to change.
Capitalism doesn’t require infinite growth. This is some trite line that was invented on Twitter and became the common wisdom in online discussions about the failings of current national and global economic systems. It’s not true. It appears to be true that the current model of capitalism favored the globe over requires infinite growth, but the current implementation of capitalism is not the same as it has always been implemented or will always be. There are more than enough legitimate criticisms of both capitalism writ large as well as current systems, we should be directing our ire through those arguments and not one that is factually false.
Life finds a way
Yarr
“Google engineers want…”
No. Google executives want this to happen. Google’s CEO wants this to happen.
They want to change the internet and remove any little bit of freedom for their own corporate profits.
Fuck “do no evil” Google.
Do? No, evil.
Why not both, Google engineers and Google execs? If you’ve ever looked at how Google engineers talk on the Linux kernel mailing lists, and their code in android internals, they tend to have a “we know best” or holier than thou attitude.
I wouldn’t be surprised to see this trash also coming from the same kind of Google developers who act like that.
These engineers are just trying to keep their job. There’s probably a lead or a manager somewhere in line with upper management involved in this and looking over the developers’ shoulders.
Google engineers can work anywhere they want. They’re responsible for this shit too. Tech is full of greedy devs with no ethics.
That’s a narrow way to view things. Google hires a LOT of people with work visas that tie them to the company.
Are the Google executives the ones that are going to write it?
No, Indian people on H-1B visas desperate for a better life are going to write it.
Holy shit. This! ☝️☝️☝️
Google execs incentivize engineers to build shit by dangling promotions to those who participate.
And then the plan to force everyone to abandon Firefox whether they like it or not.
- Implement the misfeatures.
- Movie and music websites will be the first to announce requiring DRM to be able to watch movies or listen to tunes.
- The banks will be next. “For your safety, you must use an Official Approved Browser™ to be allowed access to your money!”
- Then ecommerce sites. “You must have DRM enabled to be allowed to buy anything.”
- Then comes the social media sites. For your safety, of course…
At that point, the userbase of anything that’s not Chrome or not DRM’d to death will be so eroded that virtually everyone else will abandon Firefox support, DRM will get enabled by default. Also, comes the lobbyists to Congress demanding changes to the DMCA to throw users in prison who dare to try to crack the DRM to block ads. “Ad-blocking is stealing!”
Just means I’ll have the shittiest Chromebook I can buy used, for access to the sites you just listed, and my Linux laptop for everything else. If their non-financial, non-commerce site won’t let me in with my adblocking Linux machine, I just won’t go there. There will be lots of site still, run by us, that don’t do this shit, and they’ll get my traffic.
> Just means I’ll have the shittiest Chromebook I can buy
Google Exec: “But you did buy it, yes?”
Also gotta make sure it doesn’t “expire” or be the sucker buying ewaste that’s “no longer supported”
Not from them! They don’t make a dime when I buy yours.
My thoughts on buying used Nintendo games. Love the IPS hate how Nintendo treats people. I’ll gladly buy the new Pokémon game from you for 2 quid less than retail.
And I can bet that Google will spy on your home network from that shitty chromebook
Vlans babe!!
They already do that from my Android phone, and I’m sure as hell not going Apple. Linux phones aren’t there yet, maybe in a few years, but I’ll still need an Android phone for the same reasons I’d need a Chromebok, bank apps will never support Linux phones. And yeah, like everybody said, VLANs. I already have one for untrusted IoT devices, I’ll just spin up another for Chromebooks.
This right here is what has always scared me. The internet is getting more and more controlled and locked down as the years go on. The general population will not take up for, Linux, Firefox, etc. Neither will the services we now rely upon like banking etc. So we will be forced.
I don’t think any of this would stop me from using FF for day to day browsing.
2 - At this point I’d just pirate it. I don’t care. If you’re going to be hostile to paying customers, I’m going to be a non-paying customer again.
3 - Separate banking app. Not bothered about desktop banking
4 - Fine I’ll support local businesses where possible, and use dedicated apps or if necessary Chrome (preferably sandboxed) specifically for shopping where not.
5 - Social media was a mistake anyway, already deleted Twitter, I need very little excuse to get rid of Facebook as well.
Honestly I think this is just the end phase of “Web 2.0” as I remember all this shit being labelled at the time. We managed fine with independent forums etc before and will manage again.
Edit: I love the irony that people are killing off Reddit due to API access but the only way I’ve been able to post on lemmy.world is via the website. Connect app? Nope!
Hi. I finally have the balls to ask, what is DRM? I am kind of a neophyte in all tech matters. But I managed to get out of Reddit because it was full of baits and ridden with apple ads. And so I like this new platform, reminds me of the good old gamefaqs forums days. Hope all this slicker simpler UI from and for users never die…
Digital Rights Management. AKA the stuff that’s supposed to prevent unauthorized copying and suchlike, but in practice just means the pirates have a better experience than legit customers.
Then ecommerce sites. “You must have DRM enabled to be allowed to buy anything.”
I’m actually not sure about this one. Money is money. If I’m a vendor, and a bunch of bots want to give me money, I say bring it on. Why would any ecommerce vendor add that layer of friction, which could actually prevent a user from buying something from them? What’s in it for the vendor?
Seems to me the more likely anti-consumer hell is a points dystopia leveraged by monopolistic companies. Like apple, microsoft, or disney moving to some sort of loyalty points system where you can only buy their products using a currency and credit system that they control. Like, ‘stream this movie using your disney points card’. We’re not far off from that really.
To all of mentioned above from the bottom of my heart
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Alright, today is oficially the day I switch to Firefox
Come here, I left Firefox when Chrome first released, however after the Firefox Quantum release, I got back to using Firefox again. The container tabs feature is very useful to create a separate container for each project that I’m involved in. It’s like having multiple browsers without needing to install multiple browsers.
Although I still keep Vivaldi and Edge installed to visit some websites that doesn’t work correctly with Firefox.
Firefox, DuckDuckGo, Protonmail is my setup. I am slowy getting away from Google and all massive corps tbh, I’m spending more time on my Linux partition too.
It’s almost like Google wants me to trade my android phone in on an iphone.
They’ll succeed if they keep it up. My Pixel is the buggiest phone I’ve ever had anyway. I hate a lot of the weird little iPhone restrictions but at this point Android is getting irritating. It should be best on the Pixel but it’s not. All this BS trying to kill the open Internet is just a good reason to cut Google out, especially browser wise and device/OS.
Hey! Try using GrapheneOS! It’s a degoogled version of Android! If I’m not mistaken it uses MicroG (google services, but private and open source) instead of google services! It’s specifically made for Pixels! https://grapheneos.org/ (I never used it personally, as I do not own a pixel, but I’ve only heard good things about it.
Just use a Degoogled Android phone.
I just made the switch to iPhone about 8/9 months ago from android. I told myself I’d never do it but I did and I have 0 regrets. Just got a MacBook as well and everything just ties together beautifully.
Congrats on switching corporate overlords, and going all in on the “new” one
It’s a better product imo. Also, didn’t go “all in.” I bought a refurbished iPhone 11 and a 2 year old MacBook…and it’s STILL better for me personally. I still own 2 gaming pcs. Maybe something like that doesn’t work for others, but it does for me. Sorry that you’re so upset because of a brand I chose to switch to out of convenience and annoyance with shitty ad loaded Samsung products or PCs that are jam packed with noticeable bloated garbage out the box. And no, I don’t have time to or want to root an android or fuck around with Linux on my computers. Heaven forbid!!! lol fucking neckbeards thinking everyone needs to do what they’re doing. Are you gonna get mad because I drive certain car brand or wear expensive jeans? Find out next on “How to Please a Neckbeard” only on Lemmy at 9/8 central.
Go with a de-googled operating system for android
I wouldn’t personally switch to any Apple device at all because of the Apple being so closed off
You’ll still be using a Chromium based browser. Best bet is to switch to Firefox.
Safari isn’t Chromium based. Chromium’s engine is forked from Safari.
Which itself was forked from KHTML according to wikipedia at least
Ah yes use the OTHER chromium based browser!
Firefox isn’t Chromium
The year is 2023, every single major tech companies are racing each other to become Public Enemy No. 1. And the only Hero we have is the EU, will it be able to save the day?
Don’t have too much faith in the EU. Corporations are still heavily influencing politics. They will probably come with half assed laws that have loopholes or workarounds.
Like GDPR?
/s
I don’t get the “/s”.
The #GDPR is absolutely a perfect example of ½-assed laws & loopholes. I have filed reports on dozens of GDPR violations; not a single one of them lead to enforcement. The GDPR is just a prop to make people feel comfortable as the EU destroys the offline infrastructure.
I did as well for the Catholic Church. I don’t want to have my name associated with a gang of child molesters so I invoked the right to be forgotten. The church told me that baptism is sacred and cannot be undone. The Dutch institution for GDPR claims never did anything about it because they’re overloaded with requests.
Oh well, I’m not willing to give it more energy either. It’s mildly annoying but doesn’t affect my day to day life.
Maybe you misunderstand the enforcement part of the GDPR. It’s not made for you to get personal enforcement out of it. It works on the basis of multiple infractions being recorded and then escalating the agencies response level.
I work with many companies as IT consultant and I can assure you, that they all FEAR the GDPR and treat natural person data very well because of that. Enforcement of GDPR does happen and you can review every enforcement on a public website called enforcement tracker. There are almost 1980 enforcement actions in their database.
I have also personally requested information about me and my family through the rights bestowed by the GDPR regulations and have EVERY TIME gotten the information within 30 days.
Maybe you misunderstand the enforcement part of the GDPR. It’s not made for you to get personal enforcement out of it.
You obviously have not read article 77. This article entitles individuals to report GDPR violations to a DPA for enforcement. Article 77 does not distinguish violations against an individual (which I suppose is what you mean by “personal enforcement”) and violations against many. Some of the violations I have reported can only be construed as violations against the general public. E.g. an org fails to designate a DPO.
The problem is there is nothing to enforce article 77 itself. When a DPA neglects to act on an article 77 report, there is no recourse. There is only a provision that allows lawsuits against the GDPR violators. But then when someone did that, and then claimed legal costs, an Italian court decided for everyone in a precedence-setting case that legal costs are not recoverable. Which essentially neuters the court action remedy. So we have an unenforced article 77 and a costly & impractical direct action option.
It works on the basis of multiple infractions being recorded and then escalating the agencies response level.
It’s not even doing that much, in some cases. The report has to get past the front desk secretary and be submitted into the litigation chamber before it’s even considered as something that would indicate a trend. If it doesn’t get past the secretary it does nothing whatsoever. Some of my reports were flippantly rejected by a pre-screening secretary for bogus reasons (e.g. “your complaint is ‘contractual in nature’” when in fact there is no contractual agreement, apart from the fact that the existence of a contract does not nullify the GDPR anyway).
I work with many companies as IT consultant and I can assure you, that they all FEAR the GDPR
So you’re only seeing the commercial response. Gov agencies & NGOs are also subject to the GDPR, which is where you see the most recklessness (likely due to the lack of penalty). On the commercial side banks also don’t give much of a shit about the GDPR because when they violate it there’s a shit ton of banking regs they point to and the DPAs are afraid to act against banks because of the messy entanglement of AML/KYC laws that essentially push #banks to violate the GDPR.
Enforcement of GDPR does happen and you can review every enforcement on a public website called enforcement tracker.
Indeed I’ve browsed through the enforcement tracker. It’s a good prop for making the public believe that the #GDPR is being well enforced. They are cherry-picking cases to enforce to convince the public that something is being done, but people who actually submit reports know better. We see the reports that are clearly going unenforced.
I have also personally requested information about me and my family through the rights bestowed by the GDPR
I have had article 15 access requests denied which I then reported to the DPA, who opened a case but just sat on it. For years, so far.
(edit) By the way, I suggest you leave Lemmy·world for a different instance. If you care about privacy at all, you don’t use Cloudflare nodes. I cannot even see the msg I wrote (which you replied to) because #lemmyWorld blocks me (which I give some detail here: https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/1435972). I had to reply to you based purely on your msg without context.
Forcing this might very well be something EU opposes. While there is a lot of corporate lobbying, Google would be forcing everyone to either use chromium or make compatibility changes into other browser. While not a total monopoly, it still limits the options radically. Therefore there might be hope that EU forbids this type of action. Let’s see…
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We already can’t due to Google’s pushing of irrelevant promoted sites and failing to take meaningful action against SEO in recent years.
The EU has a larger population than the US, that’s not a market you just leave. Also, Europe is not the same as the European Union.
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The EU has a PPP GDP of $24.05 trillion compared to the US’ $25.4 trillion. That is a market of significant size and leaving it will affect Google’s bottom line.
You can compare Alabama and France all you want, that is irrelevant. Or should I perhaps start comparing Mississippi and Luxembourg?
Lastly, I don’t know if you’ve noticed but Google isn’t the only search engine in existence. Bing, Qwant et al. will gladly fill the void that Google leaves behind.
Hope you enjoy being laid off when your company eats itself to keep the growth going for just a little longer to please the capitalist parasites known as “shareholders”. You can’t much money from ads when the economy is utterly, utterly in the shitter like it is right now, not nearly as much as you used to. You really think that the average person has the financial leeway to buy luxury goods or pricier options shown in ads when the budget barely covers food, bills, rent and transport costs, and everything they do buy must be the cheapest thing they can get their hands on? Your company, and all other internet companies supported by ads, made a pact with the devil, and now he has come to collect his due. I will enjoy seeing you all go hard into the red.
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Google’s recruiting standards must’ve dipped because I can’t fathom a Googler would be this ignorant. You know there are competing search engines, right?
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You’re right, Google and Bing are the only two search engines in the world. Trolls gotta troll, I guess. Blocked.
I get by fine with Duckduckgo and Ecosia, thank you very much.
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You can’t much money from ads when the economy is utterly, utterly in the shitter like it is right now
What economy are you living in? In the US at least inflation is down, real wages are up, GDP and the stock markets are up, employment numbers are stellar…even income inequality is trending the right way. The only thing that’s “bad” is interest rates, and there’s an argument to be made they were too low to begin with before.
One where the average rent has now eclipsed the average mortgage repayment, and where all we export to the rest of the world is raw resources that are less in demand than ever
We warned you about Chrome. We told you bro.
